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Well, this is Aaron Murakami and Peter Lindeman with A&P Electronic Media from emediapress.com.

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And today is May 27th,

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and we're about four and a half weeks away from the 2014 Energy Science

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and Technology Conference,

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which you can learn about more at energiescienceconference.com.

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And today sitting with us is Mr. Jim Murray and Paul Babcock.

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And if you had followed the conference last year you know that both Jim Murray

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and Paul Babcock gave some of the most popular presentations that we've ever had.

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Jim Murray's presentation was Tesla's Hidden Discoveries

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and Paul Babcock's presentation was actually his second Presentation at

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the conference,

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in the 2012 conference,

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he gave a presentation called Magnetic Energy Secrets,

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and at the 2013 conference,

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he gave a presentation, which was a follow-up on that, MagneticEnergySecrets.com.

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The first one, Jim Murray's presentation is available at TeslasHiddenDiscoveries.com.

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And both the Pulse presentations are available at Magnetic Energy Secrets.

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Now, the first thing I kind of want to ask is that right through

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the conference last year,

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which was the end of last June,

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you both hit it off pretty well and kind

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of discovered there was some amazing synchronicities between a lot of

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the work you guys have been doing over the years,

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going on these parallel paths for a long time,

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and you want to kind of go over how The similarities in both of your

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guys' work?

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Yeah, it was a real serendipitous Twilight Zone moment there

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when we realized we started going over our motor designs and realized

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the incredible similarity between the motor's designs and the concepts about how

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to beat Lentz's Law in balancing coupling and

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A bunch of different stuff,

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so it really kind of tweaked us both a little bit,

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you know, and the meeting of the minds.

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Right.

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And from that point on,

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it was just collaboration, you know, so it's made for a really interesting year.

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So your particular motor is the flyback one which is patented and kind of went over it.

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The patent hasn't been quite granted yet but it's there.

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But the application is published and people can read that if they search for it.

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Absolutely,

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it's published

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and we should be getting that patent and that was

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the first thing we built and the last thing we patented just because

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of circumstances so it's sitting there right behind you.

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You know, we built the thing, and then it's just the same story as Jim's got.

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You know, you're trying to raise money and show people and just like talking to bricks.

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Right.

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You know, so,

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you know,

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so they were, it was beyond, at the time, it was beyond anybody's understanding.

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So the investment people were doing was,

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well, what can you do with your switching besides this motor?

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So we weren't sure, you know, so that was clear back in 2002, 2003.

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So we started hooking the thing up to regular,

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you know,

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DC motors,

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AC motors and putting other applications to the electronics and we just found

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that we could just do amazing things with inductive devices and that's where,

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so we decided we were going to patent our electronics first before we patented

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the motor and that's a long,

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long winding story of You know,

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we had a lot of great people we had to deal with and we had a lot of shysters,

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you know,

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people trying to beat us out of our intellectuals, run off of our patent for it.

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This is an incredible story.

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Someday I'm going to write a book about it.

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But so it took a long time to get back to the motor.

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Right.

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Before we had the funds, we could apply the patent for it.

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So two years ago, we actually, okay, now I get to apply for it.

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It was one of the most frustrating things I ever went through to get

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the patent filed on that thing.

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But now we're pretty close to getting it granted.

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So we're waiting for the office actions.

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Which that motor is actually sitting about two, three feet behind me right now.

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Yeah.

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In one of your several labs where you do this kind of work.

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And so the motor that you're talking about with the similarities,

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Jim, would that be your Dynaflux alternator?

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Well there are

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several motors involved in the whole thing but the one that had

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the greatest similarity was a device that we refer to as a toroid motor and Paul

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and I got discussing motors in general and we found out that we were both kind

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of like on the same track and then I started to explain to them about the concepts

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of energy resonance as I perceived them from Tesla's work which is totally different

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from frequency resonance and

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of course everybody Politely informs you there's no such thing as energy resonance.

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So you have to always,

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you know,

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either you're in an argumentative mood and you tackle it directly

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or you just circumvent the whole issue.

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I'm so tired of the whole thing, I generally don't get involved.

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But with Paul,

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it was genuine questions of real interest and so I started to explain stuff to him.

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And that's when he started to introduce the idea of his switching technology.

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And interestingly enough,

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in my own research we had come upon the limitations that are imposed

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by normal quote-unquote electronic switches.

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And the guy that I was working with at the time,

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a fellow named Eric,

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I had told him that I envisioned the fact

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that Electronic switches were not true imitations of mechanical switches and

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that that's what we needed to do.

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And so we had actually spent a great deal of time and money on that,

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not having found a solution.

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We put it on the shelf for a while.

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But then Paul informed me that they had actually solved the problem.

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So as soon as I heard that I said,

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well heck, there's a bunch of stuff that you and I can collaborate on.

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And so one thing led to another and I started telling him about Some of

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the electronic work that I had done and eventually I lit enough of his curiosity up

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that he took a plane flight down and visited me in Oklahoma and I showed him the lab

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and all of the stuff I had been working on for the past 20 years or so and it turned

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into a really neat exchange.

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So how was that going down to his lab, Paul?

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In heaven, I was just astounded.

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I was just astounded by everything I saw.

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The quality of the work,

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the amazing, you know, the amazing, the great theory it was all based on.

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It was all the same thing we do, the same theory.

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And we've taken our approach and his approach.

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But it's really all the same theory.

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So when it comes to how electricity works, it's like twin brothers.

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You know, we get it.

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And so the marriage of the two technologies was just, it's inevitable, you know.

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So I was just utterly astounded when I was in Jim's lab.

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So not very many things surprise you anymore, but this was...

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Oh, yeah.

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Oh, yeah.

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And then it's like, what do you mean you investors left you?

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What do you mean you've had this sitting around for 15 years and nobody's gave a rat?

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What?

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I was just astounded, you know.

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God, what kind of Box of Rocks guys you been dealing with, you know?

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Same kind of Box of Rocks guys I've been dealing with for years.

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I said, this just will not do.

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This stuff cannot languish, you know?

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And so when it's like, especially with the serfs, I said, I looked it over and he was right.

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All they had was standard MOSFET type switching, which isn't really true switching.

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So I said,

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you know,

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what this place needs is flyback energy technology,

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you know, the switching technology.

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And so we've done some of that recently, and it just, it's a marriage made in heaven, man.

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The switching fixed it all right up.

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So we're there, you know.

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It's like what he calls switched energy resonance.

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We call magnetic energy recovery, you know.

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It's all exactly the same concept.

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Now about a week,

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it was maybe a week ago I put on YouTube a short 10 minute excerpt out of

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a demonstration that you had done Jim with going from your Dynaflex alternator to

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the SERPs which is kind of like a solid state version of that general kind

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of concept and then you showed a transforming generator and

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In that clip it shows 100 watts roughly is being dissipated at

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the resistor creating heat so much it's about to start smoking

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yet only 5 watts are being pulled from the power supply.

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And that's before you start changing the waveforms and suddenly it's still burning

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the same amount of heat in the resistor

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and power supply is drawing negative 30 watts which means more is going back to it

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than is being drawn from it.

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And that's created quite a buzz on the internet in a couple different forums and stuff.

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I can see the There's a lot of the discussions going on where,

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you know,

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it's kind of interesting how a lot of people have a lot of comments about what it is

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and what it isn't without knowing anything about what it actually is.

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You know,

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they kind of already have their minds made up,

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but in general,

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you know,

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just kind of from a layman,

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you know,

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the concept of reactive power is not really like a layman's concept,

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but in those simple terms, it's using something known as reactive power.

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That's supposed to be kind of like this phantom power that doesn't really exist,

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yet you can actually put it to work and make it do real work?

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Well, it's a little bit more involved than that,

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but let me first lay some foundational work for you.

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The whole idea of free energy,

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which is a term that I utterly despise,

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has given people this notion That under the right circumstances you just sort

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of pull energy out of the air or out of somewhere and you have an abundance of it

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and it only requires a small trickle to get it going.

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And this is the golden calf that everybody's looking for.

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And frankly,

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I'm not saying someday something like that may or may not be possible,

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but right now that is certainly not what I'm trying to do

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and it is certainly not What Tesla did and so I think the first thing to do is

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to answer your question by sort of giving a real superficial explanation

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of what actually happens and then I'll put in some definition so

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that you can better identify the terminology.

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First of all when you When you run a load of some sort,

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particularly a resistive load connected to standard power line,

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you're essentially drawing power from the grid and it's going through your device

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and then it's changed into heat or light or whatever you're trying to do.

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And the The present belief is that that energy then leaves the system at a rate

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which is as close to 100% efficiency as you can possibly have.

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And that's why a resistor is used to generally calibrate the losses in a system

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because the belief is that whatever power you put into it is converted to heat at

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a 100% conversion rate and that's the end of the ballgame.

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Well, interestingly enough, that's not what Tesla said.

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And while I can't quote from memory every single thing I read from that guy's work,

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I can tell you that the stuff I did read got me animated enough to look at it from

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a different perspective.

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And I said, well,

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what if you borrow the wattage that you're interested in using and then have a means

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of actually sending it back where it came from?

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What is the net effect on the overall system?

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And it took me a lot of years to understand how to do that.

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But basically what happens is when you do that you suddenly become aware

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that there are two types of power.

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And I'm not talking about kilowatts and reactive power here.

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I'm talking about something much more fundamental.

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If you go into the nature of the work involved that's where you start to see it.

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So if we look at the The activity that's going on in the resistive load,

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what you finally understand is that you have

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the total work that's being done irregardless of which way the power is flowing.

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If it's flowing from source to load or from load to source,

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it's going to have to pass through your load impedance and so it's going to do work

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in both directions.

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The interesting thing is that if you're measuring power at the source,

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Now you see a different type of work being done.

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It's the net work.

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So you've got the total work on one end and the net work on the other end and

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if you do it all properly the two numbers are not equal because at the load end

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the two activities are added together and on

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the supply side they're actually subtracted.

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So when you start to realize that this is a possibility Then you start to see, ah,

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this is what Tesla was talking about when he talked

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about these hyper-efficient systems it has.

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He was just making use of the two types of work that are available and the rate at

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which you can actually perform these works and the equipment that he pioneered

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to make that all happen.

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So as it turns out,

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The instruments that we use to measure electrical power will look at the load side

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as being the total work and you'll get one wattage reading.

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If you take and monitor with the exact same meter what's happening on

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the supply side,

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you will then see a very separate phenomenon because you'll see the net reading.

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Which is the difference between the power borrowed and the power returned.

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And when you calculate the efficiency of the system based on those

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readings,

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you'll find that you have so-called over-unity.

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Because you wind up with a number greater than 100% if you do it right.

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But you're not creating anything.

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And you're not taking Any unusual power out of the environment

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or doing anything really weird,

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all you're doing is using the same power over and over again and returning it

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from whence you got it.

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So I hope that explains it a little bit better.

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I'm not going to go into too much detail here.

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Now, one analogy you gave the other day when we were actually here

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and saw what is probably the first replication of the SERPs by Paul Babcock,

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and you had used your own flyback switching technology using Jim's SERPs concepts,

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and you gave an analogy about pumping water up a hill.

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Right.

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Yeah.

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Well, that's just another way of saying that These concepts have been used over and over again.

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The only difference is the time frame in which you take advantage of the situation.

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In the example that you're referring to,

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I was talking about these water pumping stations which are used as peaking stations

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from time to time and they basically are constituting a large reservoir at the top

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of a mountain and a pumping station At the bottom of the mountain

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and they essentially turn the pumps on and run the water up the hill.

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They usually do that in the middle of the night when the power is cheap

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and they store it in the reservoir.

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And then during the course of the day when they start to have a supply problem,

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they just release the water from the reservoir and have it flow back down

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the mountain and they turn the pumps into turbines.

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And the motors into generators and they put that power back on the line.

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There's no mystery in doing that.

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There's thousands of such plants all over the place.

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The only thing that I did with this stuff,

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after a lot of years of thinking it through,

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was that instead of taking 12 hours as the period of exchange between power going

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in versus power coming out, We're doing it in milliseconds.

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But other than that, it's the same concept.

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Now, Paul,

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what is the difference between your switching technology and

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the switching technology that Jim Serps was using before you had a chance

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to replicate it?

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See, the difference is there's transistor and semiconductor switching.

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The only problem is it only works in one direction.

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It does not handle polarity reversals.

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It does not become invisible in the circuit when you open it up.

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So years ago when I started this stuff,

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started doing magnetic research,

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I was using mechanical commutators and all that stuff,

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and I just came down to the conclusion, I said,

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I have to have mechanical switching characteristics,

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but I need the speed and precision of semiconductors.

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Mm-hmm.

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And so that was the search.

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I blew up thousands of transistors and SCRs and components until we came up with

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a configuration that virtually duplicated mechanical switching.

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So when we have our semiconductor switches, when you turn them off, they're invisible.

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They go away.

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It's like they just disappeared out of the circuit.

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So they're immune to polarity reversals.

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It's a standard transistor,

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and they have to put bypass dyes and all kinds of things,

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and transistors never work with big induction, big magnetics.

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And, you know, because magnetic energy will fry stuff.

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You know, it's TV over DT.

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When that field collapses, it's just classic Faraday.

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You know, you can get millions of instantaneous watts when you turn the switch off.

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And then it's in the wrong polarity,

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the voltage reverses,

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and so your little MOSFET just blows into little pieces all over the floor.

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I know that because I've done it thousands of times.

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We can show you the broom.

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Yeah, dead soldiers as we call them.

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Oh, killed another soldier, you know.

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And so we came up with an architecture where it reproduced

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that mechanical switching characteristics.

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And once we did that,

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then we could hook transistors to big inductive bodies,

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huge transformers, lots of induction.

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And that's how we were able to start magnetic energy recovery.

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And out of that,

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when we started playing with big inductors, like,

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it's not in the camera view, but there's one sitting right up here on the shelf.

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You know, that's a four Henry coil.

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And four Henrys,

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that thing can throw 10, 20 million watts in a couple of microseconds back at you.

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And semiconductor junctions just die.

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So we also figured out that we had to be fast to make the switching transitions.

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So we came down to the conclusion that to beat magnetism

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and actually totally master it, we had to do transitions in less than 5 nanoseconds.

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Which is damn fast.

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So we created this switching transition process along the way,

(00:20:18.338):
and that way we could extract the energy out of these big bodies,

(00:20:22.061):
these big inductive bodies,

(00:20:23.742):
they'd get huge amounts of energy built up into them,

(00:20:27.045):
and then we could extract that energy out.

(00:20:29.527):
Now that all kinds of different phenomenon,

(00:20:32.130):
which were all positive,

(00:20:33.651):
it's what we call reduced impedance effect,

(00:20:35.933):
and all kinds of things we're able to do that nobody was able to do before.

(00:20:40.137):
So we take these big 4-Henry coils sitting on the shelf.

(00:20:43.539):
If I plug that into the wall socket, it won't draw a micro-amp because it's such high impedance.

(00:20:49.582):
But we hook it up to high-frequency drives.

(00:20:51.603):
I mean, I drove that thing at 400 Hz and reached almost full maximum current against

(00:20:56.265):
the resistance.

(00:20:56.645):
It's got 40 ohms of resistance.

(00:20:58.206):
So if I put 160 volts DC on it, it'll draw 4 amps.

(00:21:03.669):
Well, I can hook that up to 400 Hz, and I can get at least 2 and 3 quarter amps through it.

(00:21:10.205):
And I've had physicists just literally spit at me.

(00:21:14.186):
Seeing is not necessarily believing, let me tell you.

(00:21:17.566):
And my answer is, what part of seeing it don't you get?

(00:21:21.847):
And then they just, you're fooling me.

(00:21:24.388):
And then they start looking for wires and all this stuff.

(00:21:26.968):
And I say, it's just the same physics you use.

(00:21:32.069):
Kirchhoff, Faraday, Lentz, Ohm, Jules.

(00:21:34.230):
Those are my five guys.

(00:21:36.418):
I just tell them, you're not arguing with me, you're arguing with those five guys.

(00:21:40.582):
And if you think you can outsmart them and beat them, go for it.

(00:21:45.005):
So we just took manipulation of electromagnetics to this new level.

(00:21:51.951):
And that's how we were able to build this motor and all the stuff we do.

(00:21:55.114):
We just do all kinds of stuff with it.

(00:21:57.916):
And we've taken power sciences to a whole new level.

(00:22:03.561):
And so that's why we've We battled to commercialize it,

(00:22:07.563):
and now we're working in the Middle East a lot of places,

(00:22:10.263):
and we've just done amazing things with it.

(00:22:12.884):
And so, you know, it's a long story.

(00:22:15.505):
Someday I'm going to write a book.

(00:22:19.279):
And that's what, you know, that's what that switching did.

(00:22:22.527):
Okay, so Jim,

(00:22:23.867):
what really got you started in collaborating with Paul, and how did that take place?

(00:22:30.358):
Well, we had a lot of long telephone conversations,

(00:22:33.060):
but as you know, there's only so much you can convey over the phone.

(00:22:36.743):
So one day, I just said to him, how about if I send you a couple of videos to look at?

(00:22:43.708):
And I don't remember, how many did I send you, two?

(00:22:46.490):
Well, it was the whole Japanese thing.

(00:22:48.552):
Oh, I sent the Japanese thing first, yeah.

(00:22:50.693):
Beginning to end,

(00:22:51.534):
and then there was the Dynaflux and the Circs and the,

(00:22:54.676):
you know, the transforming generator.

(00:22:57.859):
My jaw hit my chest.

(00:23:01.192):
I was just astounded at what I was looking at,

(00:23:03.534):
and especially the SERPs,

(00:23:05.576):
that just,

(00:23:06.637):
you know,

(00:23:06.977):
just utterly astounded me at what,

(00:23:09.279):
you know,

(00:23:09.539):
because I know Jim knows how to measure power,

(00:23:11.481):
and I'm looking at his test equipment,

(00:23:13.443):
quality power,

(00:23:14.664):
a guy that knows his physics,

(00:23:16.145):
knows how to measure power,

(00:23:17.907):
he ain't fooling no,

(00:23:18.908):
you know,

(00:23:19.548):
this is no con job,

(00:23:20.849):
this is the real stuff,

(00:23:21.970):
you know,

(00:23:22.231):
the real deal, and for the life of me, I couldn't figure out what he was doing.

(00:23:26.694):
And so, He explained it and it actually explained some of it to me and it made sense.

(00:23:32.916):
But the waveforms and stuff just freaking blew my mind.

(00:23:36.599):
It took me a while to really analyze the waveforms.

(00:23:38.921):
I said, Jim, first chance I can get, I'm coming down.

(00:23:41.262):
I'd have been there the next week, but you know how it is when you're running a company.

(00:23:45.465):
So it took to almost Christmas before I could get down there.

(00:23:49.768):
And the conference was at the end of July.

(00:23:51.510):
Yeah, exactly.

(00:23:51.870):
So that was another five, six months or so.

(00:23:55.457):
Found a window and bought a plane ticket and went to visit Jim, you know.

(00:24:00.539):
And so we hung out in the lab for, what, three or four days there.

(00:24:03.520):
And he let me totally back engineer the search, take it apart, look at it, analyze it.

(00:24:07.762):
And he had a really good scope like we use.

(00:24:10.823):
And I just was astounded at what I'd discovered.

(00:24:13.725):
And he says, well, you're the first guy in 15 years that's ever figured it out.

(00:24:17.986):
And I go, well, why?

(00:24:19.467):
It's so damn simple.

(00:24:20.948):
It's so freaking simple.

(00:24:22.768):
And it was exactly the same, you know, what we do.

(00:24:26.590):
You don't need any esoteric theory.

(00:24:29.151):
It's all right there staring us in the face in the laws we know about how

(00:24:33.979):
that proves that Newton's third law does not necessarily and always apply

(00:24:39.216):
to electromagnetics.

(00:24:42.078):
And that's where the whole bugaboo lies with all

(00:24:44.799):
the naysayers is they stuck Newton's third law to electromagnetics

(00:24:49.702):
in every situation.

(00:24:51.323):
And that's a trap.

(00:24:52.982):
You know, that's what I call Maxwell's tyranny.

(00:24:55.784):
You know, if that's all you configure magnetics, that's the only result you're going to get.

(00:25:00.927):
Well, here was totally different configurations of manipulating

(00:25:04.470):
and controlling electromagnetic phenomenon.

(00:25:07.552):
And I've always said there's,

(00:25:08.732):
and so, and it was just right down all, you know, Tesla had it down.

(00:25:13.255):
And how Jim has, the way he had done the thing.

(00:25:18.220):
Was so innovative by totally doing things in quadrants rather than cycles

(00:25:23.782):
and half cycles, it just blew my mind.

(00:25:26.083):
Because I know what I know how to measure power.

(00:25:28.564):
I've been doing it my whole life, my whole working career.

(00:25:31.205):
So I knew that this is real stuff.

(00:25:34.086):
Then I also deduced this needs flyback switching.

(00:25:37.487):
We combine our switching with this concept and it's off to the races.

(00:25:41.829):
And we did it.

(00:25:44.815):
When I got back,

(00:25:46.096):
I had all my data,

(00:25:46.957):
and it took me,

(00:25:47.597):
you know,

(00:25:48.238):
work exploded,

(00:25:49.039):
so I didn't get to it quite as fast as I wanted to,

(00:25:51.040):
so over the next six months, I built a prototype.

(00:25:53.923):
In fact,

(00:25:54.683):
this switch right here,

(00:25:55.484):
I took it apart,

(00:25:56.365):
some of our old prototype stuff,

(00:25:58.747):
reconfigured it,

(00:25:59.928):
built the driver board,

(00:26:01.409):
designed up a driver board and built it,

(00:26:04.532):
and it took me a little bit of troubleshooting,

(00:26:06.213):
but all of a sudden, poof,

(00:26:08.115):
there it was,

(00:26:09.796):
the SERP's waveforms,

(00:26:10.917):
and, you know, called up Jim, and, I said, get your butt up here, man.

(00:26:16.894):
We've got some things to do.

(00:26:18.975):
So first chance we got, we got together here.

(00:26:21.416):
And then over the winter, I talked him into us doing a co-presentation at the conference.

(00:26:26.737):
Which is coming up here in four and a half weeks.

(00:26:28.338):
Yeah, and that's why.

(00:26:29.118):
So we've been working on our presentation.

(00:26:30.819):
But what we really want to do is, with Tesla, the brilliant mind he was, was a really smart guy.

(00:26:40.382):
And he really presented stuff.

(00:26:43.115):
To people like a patent lawyer,

(00:26:45.235):
where you have to be skilled in the arts to know what he's talking about,

(00:26:48.616):
which is very few people.

(00:26:50.996):
And that's why so much of his work and what he's saying has been languishing.

(00:26:56.857):
And so Jim really is the guy who really deciphered this, the guy who really needs the credit.

(00:27:02.558):
I remember looking at all these photographs of Teslas

(00:27:04.879):
with all these big commutator systems,

(00:27:07.199):
switching commutators, but there was no explanation.

(00:27:09.800):
What is that experiment?

(00:27:11.020):
What is he doing?

(00:27:12.801):
And nobody knew.

(00:27:14.802):
But he wrote it and he said it.

(00:27:16.722):
It's just if you're not skilled in the arts, you can't decipher it.

(00:27:19.563):
And the other thing about Tesla is he was a pre-voltage guy, or pre-electron guy.

(00:27:26.266):
You know, so all those early experimenters, that was completely long before electron theory.

(00:27:33.548):
And so they more, they expressed their theories and stuff more in fluid dynamics.

(00:27:39.558):
And when you understand that, it's a lot easier to decipher what he was talking about.

(00:27:45.003):
So, you know, over our lifetimes, we actually got skilled in the arts enough to decipher Tesla.

(00:27:53.031):
And that's what Jim did with the search.

(00:27:55.053):
And Tesla was saying, there's power in the current, reactive power.

(00:28:00.135):
You know, scientists laugh, but his terminology got warped.

(00:28:04.537):
You know, Steinmetz, GE, all this come along.

(00:28:07.218):
They wrote the books,

(00:28:08.018):
and they really,

(00:28:09.059):
all that old terminology that meant different things to those early guys got turned

(00:28:15.081):
into something completely different.

(00:28:16.582):
So our definitions of the words are different than the definitions they actually meant.

(00:28:23.265):
Yeah, I started down that line of communication in 2006.

(00:28:27.286):
Yeah, yeah.

(00:28:29.365):
And it's true, it's a fact.

(00:28:31.707):
A good example of that is if you just talk about inductance.

(00:28:38.433):
Nowadays we measure it in joule seconds per coulomb squared.

(00:28:42.556):
No, joule seconds squared per coulomb squared.

(00:28:45.719):
And the interesting thing is that Tesla measured it in meters or centimeters.

(00:28:52.626):
And so, you know,

(00:28:53.947):
when I was trying to decipher his work, I'm saying, what on earth does that mean?

(00:28:58.751):
And it forced you to go back and research really early stuff to see what the heck

(00:29:04.636):
the relationships were.

(00:29:06.558):
And, you know,

(00:29:07.078):
in those days,

(00:29:08.179):
they were actually banking on the relationship between,

(00:29:13.824):
for lack of a better term, magnetic inertia and the properties that it had.

(00:29:20.129):
In circuits and then take that to the next step and add mass into the picture

(00:29:25.410):
and you know you start to get a very very different picture of the way they looked

(00:29:30.831):
at this stuff.

(00:29:32.292):
But the whole concept of reactive power

(00:29:36.212):
the way Tesla envisioned it actually came very clear to me years ago

(00:29:39.913):
and I read this one amazing book where he was being deposed in a court case

(00:29:47.475):
and he was talking about You know, how he actually powered his transmitters.

(00:29:55.808):
And two very interesting things came out of that.

(00:29:58.610):
First of all,

(00:29:59.610):
the attorney said to him,

(00:30:01.692):
and it's right there in print,

(00:30:05.395):
so I understand that you have made the statement that you can power

(00:30:09.197):
a 10,000 watt transmitter with only 2,000 watt input.

(00:30:14.722):
And he says, so obviously you're talking about instantaneous power.

(00:30:19.132):
And Tesla said, oh no, it's very much continuous power, which of course is a mind blower.

(00:30:25.137):
He didn't have to say anything else.

(00:30:26.918):
That would have been enough to blow anybody's mind in those days.

(00:30:31.101):
And then the other thing of course that came out

(00:30:33.523):
of it was years ago

(00:30:39.008):
started wondering about the magnifying transmitter and how

(00:30:43.071):
that operated.

(00:30:45.493):
The thing that bugged me more than anything was the third coil, the mysterious third coil.

(00:30:51.755):
And it took me years to figure out what that thing actually does.

(00:30:57.897):
And I've had conversations with Eric Dollard,

(00:31:01.098):
with Gaia Balinski,

(00:31:03.619):
with all kinds of characters, and everybody had a different opinion of it.

(00:31:07.880):
So I came to the conclusion,

(00:31:10.021):
after a lot of meditation,

(00:31:12.055):
That it had a very singular purpose and that if I was correct in my understanding

(00:31:17.298):
of it I should be able to do something really unusual if I duplicated some

(00:31:24.602):
of his descriptions in the narrative.

(00:31:28.004):
So at great personal cost Time-wise,

(00:31:32.462):
and with money provided by Josh Reynolds of all people,

(00:31:37.185):
I actually built a device which produced the mysterious Tesla Wave.

(00:31:44.328):
And once I saw what that did, everything fell into the line.

(00:31:48.790):
And I'm not going to elaborate on that because none of that is patented,

(00:31:54.812):
but I can tell you that all of the SERP stuff and all of the Dynaflux stuff And

(00:32:02.024):
a lot of the other stuff that we haven't even talked about actually flows from

(00:32:05.507):
that understanding.

(00:32:07.308):
So the SERPS, S-E-R-P-S, and that stands for Switched Energy Resonance Power Supply?

(00:32:14.035):
Yes, Switched Energy Resonance Power Supply.

(00:32:16.377):
And so the origin of the,

(00:32:19.199):
I guess, inspiration for that solid state model is the DynaFlex alternator?

(00:32:26.391):
Oh yes, because I had a very profound experience in Michigan.

(00:32:30.854):
It was one of several during my lifetime.

(00:32:34.035):
The first one was actually in Connecticut.

(00:32:36.597):
But the one that I had in Michigan literally gave me a vision of what was possible

(00:32:43.641):
to achieve if you understood the use of non-circular armature.

(00:32:51.625):
And so it took me years to understand what that was all about.

(00:32:55.535):
Because it's anything but obvious.

(00:32:58.536):
And once I realized what it was about,

(00:33:00.697):
that's when my understanding of so-called energy resonance came into the picture.

(00:33:06.740):
And the reason why it's difficult to understand that is because you're talking

(00:33:09.961):
about optimizing the exchange of a periodic exchange between one or more types

(00:33:18.945):
of energy.

(00:33:25.375):
That is also optimized.

(00:33:27.896):
And that's very difficult stuff.

(00:33:31.378):
So just for the lay person,

(00:33:33.799):
you're talking about exchanging energy between an electrical resonance phenomena and

(00:33:38.441):
a physical resonance phenomena, for instance.

(00:33:40.482):
Well, yeah,

(00:33:40.943):
for instance,

(00:33:41.543):
like an

(00:33:41.923):
electromagnetic effect on one end and a mechanical effect on the other,

(00:33:46.785):
or a strictly electrical effect on one end and a mechanical effect on the other.

(00:33:52.708):
Most of that stuff is deliberately taken out of the loop

(00:33:56.710):
when you design normal motors and generators because they all work

(00:34:00.252):
on average values, average magnetic values.

(00:34:04.234):
And I did just the opposite.

(00:34:06.235):
I wanted to see what the effect was that forces have when they are brought to their peak values.

(00:34:13.678):
And it was a result of playing around with that stuff for a number of years

(00:34:18.741):
that I finally got the idea and now I realized I'm not even equipped to analyze

(00:34:24.857):
the math because you're talking about second and third order differential equations

(00:34:30.279):
that have, you know, non-constant features in them.

(00:34:35.962):
They have oscillating components in them that require matrices

(00:34:43.044):
and other advanced things to solve.

(00:34:45.405):
But I ran into a guy in Pennsylvania when I was working for Piyaseki Aircraft Corporation.

(00:34:52.623):
And he said, oh, is that what you're trying to do?

(00:34:54.863):
He said, I just happen to be good at that.

(00:34:59.505):
So we spent a lot of years together until we got the Dynaplex thing pretty well figured out.

(00:35:05.506):
And then I said, well,

(00:35:06.646):
I guess the next thing to do is to find somebody that wants to invest in this

(00:35:10.848):
and will start building them.

(00:35:12.588):
And couldn't find a soul.

(00:35:15.189):
So for the longest time, it just sat in my basement.

(00:35:17.950):
I used to run it for my own amusement.

(00:35:20.401):
And then it dawned on me one day that I should be able to duplicate that principle

(00:35:25.784):
in electronics simply because if it's truly an expression of physics,

(00:35:32.507):
it shouldn't make any difference what realm I decide to make it operate in.

(00:35:38.070):
And at the time I knew a guy who was an ex-Navy SEAL and he had worked

(00:35:44.193):
on some fantastic stuff for the Navy Department and he was more or less Unentangled

(00:35:50.869):
or disentangled from the Navy Department.

(00:35:53.330):
So he helped me build the first one, which was tube powered.

(00:35:58.212):
Because this went back so long ago that they didn't have

(00:36:01.133):
the necessary electronics available at that time.

(00:36:05.436):
And the first time we fired it up, it just did some weird things in his apartment.

(00:36:10.558):
It browned out about three or four different apartment complexes in his area.

(00:36:15.921):
So we said, well, I guess we better tone that down.

(00:36:19.635):
Find a more benign way of playing with that.

(00:36:24.738):
But that was actually the first SERPs unit.

(00:36:27.759):
And that was, oh, thirty years ago.

(00:36:30.741):
Wow.

(00:36:32.842):
Now you played around with some mechanical or brush switching in your explorations

(00:36:38.765):
of moving in that direction?

(00:36:40.326):
Oh yeah, but that was long before we built the tube thing.

(00:36:45.389):
Yeah, because I've been a machinist since I was about twelve.

(00:36:49.550):
And I had a lathe and a milling machine and all that kind of stuff in my basement.

(00:36:53.414):
So I thought, well the easiest thing to do is to just use ordinary mechanical

(00:36:59.461):
commutation.

(00:37:01.883):
Played hell with arcs and all kinds of stuff.

(00:37:04.026):
But it taught me enough to know that that's not the best direction.

(00:37:07.810):
Spark machines.

(00:37:08.811):
Spark machines, yeah.

(00:37:10.156):
Well, I mean,

(00:37:10.476):
a lot of Tesla's commutation systems that you see the pictures of

(00:37:16.639):
with all these triangular lines and all this kind of stuff,

(00:37:19.940):
these were where he was starting to look into pulse width modulation

(00:37:24.602):
and all this kind of stuff with mechanical switching.

(00:37:27.603):
That's all he has.

(00:37:28.924):
He invented PWM, and people don't even know that.

(00:37:31.765):
Yeah, exactly.

(00:37:34.526):
So, yeah, it's just amazing.

(00:37:37.372):
Now, here in a couple days,

(00:37:39.454):
we're going to be releasing a package of,

(00:37:42.015):
you know,

(00:37:42.796):
it's going to show the so-called Japanese demo where it had

(00:37:46.198):
the Dynaflex alternator demo, the SERPs, and the transforming generator in there.

(00:37:51.743):
And we're going to be giving an older presentation,

(00:37:54.424):
which is just kind of a free bonus we're going to throw in there,

(00:37:58.588):
which is kind of hard to see some of the pictures.

(00:38:00.429):
It looks like it's on a television screen behind you, and it's kind of dark.

(00:38:04.252):
And, but...

(00:38:06.192):
The information's A1, it's great.

(00:38:09.033):
But you can obviously hear it pretty well, and the explanations are pretty good.

(00:38:13.335):
I mean, as far as the audio goes,

(00:38:15.475):
the pictures are a little bit dark,

(00:38:16.596):
but you can see them good enough to tell what's going on.

(00:38:20.317):
And we'd recommend,

(00:38:22.258):
or at least I'd recommend somebody watch that first before the Japanese demo,

(00:38:25.819):
because that kind of gives more of the background on it,

(00:38:28.100):
and then it walks into the demo.

(00:38:32.088):
Is there anything you can say about that other video?

(00:38:34.649):
That was the one you gave it for Stephen Greer.

(00:38:38.491):
Yeah, that was the one that Stephen Greer did of me.

(00:38:41.273):
It was done in Washington, D.C. a number of years ago.

(00:38:44.494):
2007, I think.

(00:38:46.315):
It was like December 2007 or something like that.

(00:38:48.696):
Yeah, I honestly don't remember.

(00:38:50.097):
If that's what it was, that's fine.

(00:38:51.878):
But believe it or not, I've never seen it.

(00:38:54.279):
Okay.

(00:38:54.739):
We'll get you a copy.

(00:38:58.361):
We'll give you the link.

(00:38:59.201):
You can download it.

(00:39:02.749):
But I do remember the approximate approach I took,

(00:39:06.012):
you know,

(00:39:06.393):
and it was all about the various types of research I had done earlier,

(00:39:11.558):
how it led into my thinking and all that kind of stuff.

(00:39:14.431):
Well,

(00:39:14.591):
I think what the advent of that talk was is that you were slated to give that at

(00:39:19.994):
the end of July in 2007,

(00:39:21.855):
and you were there,

(00:39:22.455):
and they cut you off in the middle saying, we have to get back on schedule.

(00:39:26.277):
You were so bummed out.

(00:39:28.518):
You were so mad.

(00:39:30.019):
And then there was another individual,

(00:39:32.580):
I won't mention any names,

(00:39:34.361):
who talked for an hour and a half after me about an underground house.

(00:39:38.783):
Yeah.

(00:39:39.243):
And I said to myself, if that's what you want, that's what you'll get.

(00:39:42.744):
And I have turned their invitation down religiously ever since.

(00:39:49.025):
I was in the audience and I just about stood up and said, no, no, don't stop.

(00:39:55.987):
But, you know, in a room of 300 people, it's too crazy.

(00:40:01.513):
I just couldn't believe it.

(00:40:02.655):
And then you were swarmed.

(00:40:03.776):
I was going to come over and say hi.

(00:40:06.419):
And then you just stormed out and left.

(00:40:08.542):
And I never saw you again.

(00:40:11.866):
But that was just a wild story in and of itself.

(00:40:15.129):
So I'm glad you actually got to be able to give the whole talk to somebody,

(00:40:18.433):
even if it's on a television.

(00:40:21.250):
Well, I also gave an updated version of that last year.

(00:40:24.371):
Exactly, yeah.

(00:40:26.112):
So, Tesla's Hidden Discoveries is really an updated version.

(00:40:31.853):
We made the images a lot clearer to see and everything else.

(00:40:36.235):
But the thing is,

(00:40:37.775):
your commentary on that original one actually covers some territory that isn't in

(00:40:43.417):
the new one.

(00:40:44.957):
I think they're both worth seeing.

(00:40:50.888):
And I would say that the depth where you're giving

(00:40:54.590):
the three different demonstrations plus that other video would probably be

(00:40:58.971):
a good primer for anybody to be able to watch,

(00:41:01.752):
to kind of prepare themselves for the presentation coming out,

(00:41:05.834):
which you and Jim are going to be giving at this upcoming conference at the end

(00:41:09.595):
of June.

(00:41:10.075):
Yeah, we're going to,

(00:41:11.876):
I think we're going to really open up some minds,

(00:41:16.178):
or hopefully that's the goal,

(00:41:18.499):
and really Explain to people how this stuff really works.

(00:41:23.029):
So what would somebody hope to be able to learn from the presentation?

(00:41:28.852):
Like first of all getting their definition straight of what,

(00:41:33.115):
you know, to be able to define the terms?

(00:41:35.056):
My biggest thing is to get people,

(00:41:38.958):
especially the science community,

(00:41:40.719):
to break out of their, you know, their like puppy dogs tied to a chain.

(00:41:46.767):
And to expand their belief system, they're just in a box.

(00:41:50.369):
And that box is Maxwell.

(00:41:52.709):
And I have nothing against Maxwell himself,

(00:41:55.090):
but what was done to his work, I have something serious against.

(00:41:58.872):
And that Mother Nature uses Newton III's law with electromagnetics to create a balance.

(00:42:05.875):
And that's how Mother Nature does it.

(00:42:07.615):
But that doesn't mean we have to do it that way.

(00:42:10.957):
It's like going up to a diesel engine and tweaking the governor so

(00:42:14.058):
the governor no longer restricts the engine.

(00:42:17.165):
And that's what we do.

(00:42:18.626):
We learn how to prevent magnetism from clashing with itself.

(00:42:23.807):
And so it all boils down to this.

(00:42:26.528):
And all the free energy research, everybody's looking for the magic equation.

(00:42:30.510):
Well, the truth about, you know, I hate this term over unity and free energy too.

(00:42:35.611):
The truth about it is what you're looking for are mathematical expressions or inequalities.

(00:42:41.673):
Because if it's equal, it's the same.

(00:42:45.094):
Talking about the net on the input compared to what you're actually measuring at the load.

(00:42:48.698):
And so the mathematical expressions have to say this is more than this.

(00:42:55.345):
And we have all the proof of physics you could ask for to prove that.

(00:42:59.848):
So there will be some basic math in there,

(00:43:02.149):
and there will be an explanation of how the known laws of physics were already used,

(00:43:06.572):
which I've pretty much done as kind of a continuous elastic.

(00:43:10.294):
We have all these known laws.

(00:43:11.635):
If you use them differently,

(00:43:12.795):
you get incredible results, and you don't have to go off into esoteric theories.

(00:43:17.918):
You know, I like, you know, zero-point energy theory and all that, but...

(00:43:22.121):
Who needs it?

(00:43:22.821):
Who needs it?

(00:43:23.601):
Exactly!

(00:43:25.175):
Who needs it?

(00:43:25.756):
It's all right here.

(00:43:29.181):
By the way, he's not saying he's changing the laws or using the laws differently or incorrectly.

(00:43:35.926):
He's just using them in situations that you normally wouldn't think of

(00:43:40.891):
if you thought only in a very small way.

(00:43:43.914):
Exactly.

(00:43:47.518):
You can't look at things as immutable,

(00:43:49.379):
you know,

(00:43:49.860):
it's the same laws,

(00:43:51.100):
I just, you know, Maxwell expresses a configuration, a physical configuration.

(00:43:58.305):
If I take two magnetic fields and I clash them together, you're going to get drag force.

(00:44:05.050):
So like,

(00:44:05.530):
what's so cool with the service machine and all these concepts,

(00:44:08.052):
and it's like what we do with our stuff,

(00:44:10.714):
is if you're making electricity,

(00:44:13.135):
alternating electricity, that means you have to have horsepower.

(00:44:17.167):
Solar panels and batteries are a little different,

(00:44:18.948):
but in the grid system,

(00:44:21.349):
this means magnetism is causing drag forces which must be overcome with horsepower.

(00:44:27.732):
Well when you take and you borrow some force from that motor

(00:44:33.234):
and you cause drag force,

(00:44:34.735):
you use the electricity and when you put it back it becomes motive force.

(00:44:39.457):
So motive force cancels out counter motive force and the torque

(00:44:44.179):
and horsepower you need It goes way down because now there's less load on the motor

(00:44:50.703):
because I've canceled out the drag force with motive force

(00:44:54.045):
but I made work both directions at the load end.

(00:44:57.827):
So now suddenly my generator doesn't have near as much drag in it

(00:45:02.570):
so I'm burning less fuel and my power output at the load has gone up.

(00:45:10.615):
So that just blows That's what I'm saying.

(00:45:14.019):
It's a different configuration than the clashing of magnetic fields.

(00:45:17.921):
We're learning how to interlace energy back to the prime mover source.

(00:45:23.784):
And so guess what happens to my fuel consumption on a generator that I'm doing this with?

(00:45:28.647):
Now I'm getting all my lights lit up for just a little sip of fuel instead

(00:45:32.870):
of gallons of fuel every hour.

(00:45:35.466):
And it's just factual.

(00:45:37.267):
You can't argue with it.

(00:45:38.207):
It's just the same exact laws of physics.

(00:45:39.967):
It adds up.

(00:45:41.047):
We're proving it with the SERPs.

(00:45:42.188):
We're proving it with our machines.

(00:45:43.408):
It's just, I get tired of arguing with people, you know.

(00:45:47.149):
So it's just the way it is.

(00:45:49.930):
So at the upcoming conference at the end of June,

(00:45:52.430):
which all the information on the conference is at energyscienceconference.com,

(00:45:59.232):
I would imagine that this is probably going to be maybe the most Important

(00:46:04.768):
or revealing talk on the concepts of so-called using reactive power

(00:46:08.870):
as energy compared to anything else out there.

(00:46:12.772):
Because there's nothing out there that's really...

(00:46:14.533):
First of all, nobody's even talking about this subject.

(00:46:17.515):
This is all,

(00:46:18.955):
I've watched all the stuff,

(00:46:20.396):
and that's why I've stayed off the forums and the internets and all that,

(00:46:24.318):
because so much of it's all the rehash of the same old stuff.

(00:46:27.940):
Well, this is a cultivation of two lifetimes of work that have just,

(00:46:32.983):
you know,

(00:46:33.443):
it's like,

(00:46:35.494):
I knew I had a good handle on it,

(00:46:36.995):
but when I went down and took the SERPs apart and played with Jim's stuff,

(00:46:40.639):
it was just like all of a sudden the last bit of the fog was gone.

(00:46:46.404):
It's clear to me exactly how it works.

(00:46:49.127):
I don't even have to think about it anymore and I know where to go in

(00:46:51.949):
the development of this technology.

(00:46:54.252):
And I have this belief that Tesla was every bit a prophet as much as he was.

(00:47:00.257):
An inventor and a genius.

(00:47:02.078):
You know, look what the man gave us.

(00:47:04.180):
So in his later life,

(00:47:05.380):
Tesla's lament was, well,

(00:47:07.782):
the bankers and industrialists have taken my work and made this century theirs.

(00:47:14.466):
But he goes, but I tell you, the next century will be mine.

(00:47:17.688):
And that's what I'm about.

(00:47:18.869):
This is going to be the real Tesla century.

(00:47:22.751):
We've uncovered what he was telling us.

(00:47:25.713):
And we've opened up a whole new world of science and application.

(00:47:30):
And it's going to happen.

(00:47:31.522):
It's happening now.

(00:47:33.423):
And, you know,

(00:47:34.384):
that's what I came to this world to do is to advance humankind and

(00:47:39.088):
to bring this stuff to fruition.

(00:47:40.790):
And, you know, it's just going to happen.

(00:47:43.753):
And, you know, I've given many a PhD in intellectual beating.

(00:47:47.316):
You know, I'm not adverse to doing it some more if I have to.

(00:47:50.959):
So that's how it goes, you know.

(00:47:55.021):
But I'm not taking any prisoners.

(00:47:57.122):
We're not slowing down.

(00:47:58.502):
We're not in a bag.

(00:48:00.122):
It's just going to happen.

(00:48:01.283):
And if we can engender public support and open minds,

(00:48:06.024):
you know, people's minds have to open to the concept.

(00:48:08.725):
They have to throw off the old conditioning, especially with electrical physics.

(00:48:13.466):
And the more people that do that, it builds up more.

(00:48:16.447):
It's logarithmic.

(00:48:17.287):
It builds up more momentum.

(00:48:19.208):
It opens people's eyes to the possibility.

(00:48:21.508):
They start realizing it's a factual...

(00:48:24.950):
And then that will drive the process further.

(00:48:29.773):
And do you have any final comments or words of encouragement or suggestions

(00:48:34.776):
for everybody out there that's going to be watching this interview?

(00:48:38.059):
Well, Paul and I were discussing something along those lines just yesterday

(00:48:42.141):
and I think it's important to relate the following.

(00:48:46.264):
You know,

(00:48:47.364):
the whole thing with people who do independent research has been for

(00:48:50.947):
the longest time, keep your information to yourself.

(00:48:55.518):
Race down to the patent office at your earliest possibility

(00:48:58.539):
and get everything squared away in your name and then sit around totally paranoid

(00:49:05.480):
while you're waiting for the first office action.

(00:49:08.521):
And the irony of all of that nonsense is that you actually play right into the hands

(00:49:14.282):
of certain individuals who don't want any change.

(00:49:18.723):
And while I'm still required to patent stuff for my own protection and so is Paul,

(00:49:25.007):
I think that the other lesson that we need to get from this is that intercooperation

(00:49:31.330):
and opening your ideas to each other and sharing stuff in the long run is probably

(00:49:40.373):
a lot more valuable than hoarding the information and hoping for the best.

(00:49:44.915):
Because if you follow that route, you're going to get one incredible screwing.

(00:49:50.097):
We'll leave it at that.

(00:49:52.998):
Well, thank you gentlemen.

(00:49:53.879):
This video will be online shortly and I hope everybody enjoys this

(00:49:58.427):
and I look forward to seeing a presentation at this upcoming conference.

(00:50:01.291):
See you at the conference.

(00:50:02.393):
It's going to be the best one yet, I got a feeling.

(00:50:04.537):
Yep, thank you.

(00:50:26.823):
So we eventually figured out that it's the switching time of the power

(00:50:33.950):
that is most critical and that is achieved in lots of different ways

(00:50:38.495):
and this machine is done mechanically or it can also be done

(00:50:41.618):
with electronic switching.

(00:50:55.699):
Here's the results to that if you like to keep it.

(00:51:04.186):
So, as you...

(00:51:09.271):
In the original one that we showed you the first time in this room,

(00:51:12.214):
the little tiny one, it was only capable of handling about 30 watts.

(00:51:16.437):
We had more trouble with the switching arrangement than that.

(00:51:19.860):
It was very, very difficult to scale it up.

(00:51:29.574):
Since that time Eric has developed a new control module and a new switching module

(00:51:36.543):
and we've had a larger set of capacitors to store the energy.

(00:51:42.620):
This is the control, and this is the switching, and this is the capacitor to store energy.

(00:51:48.263):
So these segments are all new.

(00:51:50.343):
The one that we showed you before was a little tiny computer driven model.

(00:51:56.206):
And this one is much more flexible.

(00:52:10.143):
And it allows us to control the wave function geometry,

(00:52:13.584):
which in turn gives you the resulting change in efficiencies that we're going

(00:52:18.726):
to show you.

(00:52:34.197):
Now we have it set right now to imitate approximately the results we gave you the first time.

(00:52:39.839):
So in this resistor,

(00:52:40.839):
which is the load now, we are dissipating about 30, a little less than 32 watts.

(00:52:45.980):
From the line, from the line we're pulling

(00:53:03.944):
Almost 11 watts, 10.97, 10.98 watts.

(00:53:08.388):
Now what we're going to show you is,

(00:53:10.269):
and the reason I have the scope on here is so that you can watch

(00:53:14.053):
the waveforms change in accordance with the changing efficiencies that we're going

(00:53:19.877):
to show you.

(00:53:25.142):
Eric, you want to take over and let's, the first thing we want to do is probably bring it down.

(00:53:32.919):
Now what he's doing now,

(00:53:33.920):
if you watch the waveforms changing,

(00:53:36.521):
you can see that the geometry of the waves changes in accordance with the results.

(00:53:42.364):
We are now dialing down so that the input power is only...

(00:53:48.067):
It's all the way down for the current setting I have.

(00:53:50.468):
Okay, so right now we're only pulling 1.5 watts from the wall

(00:53:54.750):
and we're still giving you 33.5 watts.

(00:54:04.956):
But we'll leave this setting

(00:54:06.737):
fixed for the moment.

(00:54:07.678):
Eric, crank it up.

(00:54:09.339):
Now we're going to show you that we're not limited anymore to 30 watts.

(00:54:12.822):
So now we've got 100 watts in the load and we're pulling 5 watts.

(00:54:15.604):
That's 2,000%.

(00:54:32.601):
Yeah, we can't leave on too long,

(00:54:34.263):
it'll smoke, but you can put your hand on there, it's bloody hot.

(00:54:36.965):
Now, we have one other little thing to show you, and it's

(00:54:39.928):
pretty, it's pretty scarful.

(00:54:52.618):
If you continue to change the waveforms appropriately on this,

(00:54:58.120):
due to the way that these capacitors are made to operate with these switches,

(00:55:02.001):
we can actually send back more current than we take from the line.

(00:55:06.462):
And that results in these wattages going negative.

(00:55:16.437):
So that means we are still dissipating 102 watts in the resistor

(00:55:21.859):
but we're sending back

(00:55:26.081):
30 watts to the power company.

(00:55:31.224):
Now the implications of that,

(00:55:33.125):
if we can marry this with even your standard wind generators right now,

(00:55:37.907):
the power that's going back will help it to turn like a motor and you'll operate

(00:55:42.169):
with less wind.

(00:55:54.193):
Now question, in relation to the mix you're getting from the grid.

(00:55:59.297):
Yeah, it's starting to smoke.

(00:56:00.959):
Turn it down.

(00:56:02.019):
In relation to the mix you're getting, you're getting reactive energy.

(00:56:09.065):
No, see, this is, well, yes and no.

(00:56:11.267):
You have to understand that in a normal situation, reactive power is defined.

(00:56:18.365):
As a form of restorative tower in which the average value is zero.

(00:56:26.369):
The problem with that is that the current and the voltage are usually out of phase

(00:56:32.373):
by 90 degrees, which means that you can't use it.

(00:56:36.775):
What this device allows you to do is to create watts that are doing the same thing

(00:56:42.598):
of going back and forth.

(00:56:43.658):
So the wattage becomes reactive.

(00:56:46.060):
Wow.

(00:56:46.718):
See, here's the thing.

(00:56:48.280):
In Japan, average wind is like two meters.

(00:56:51.883):
So if we could bring it down to the second, we can rotate by one meter wind.

(00:56:57.929):
That makes a huge impact.

(00:57:01.652):
Well, as soon as we have the funds to do so,

(00:57:04.655):
I would like to get a standard alternator that you guys use,

(00:57:07.998):
or whatever kind of generator you use, and try to marry this system with that.

(00:57:12.492):
Put the instruments on it to see how fast it's turning and then see what the effect is.

(00:57:19.102):
Let's say on a global scale,

(00:57:24.922):
I mean a large scale,

(00:57:26.223):
say there's a hundred million units like this in America,

(00:57:29.746):
what effect would that have on the grid?

(00:57:31.348):
Okay, that's a very interesting question and I know the answer to it

(00:57:34.470):
because I researched it thoroughly.

(00:57:36.952):
Tesla himself said a hundred years ago That if we used reactive power instead of

(00:57:43.740):
the normal kilowatts,

(00:57:45.282):
and he was referring to reactive kilowatts,

(00:57:47.584):
not the normal reactive power,

(00:57:49.947):
that our present transmission grids could bear a thousand times the load

(00:57:57.234):
that it can sustain right now for exactly the same fuel consumption.

(00:58:04.140):
And that's not an exaggeration.

(00:58:06.601):
The question was,

(00:58:08.002):
the effect of this on a global scale with 100 million units in America,

(00:58:12.184):
everybody having one of these, what would happen to the grid?

(00:58:14.405):
The answer was?

(00:58:16.006):
And the answer is that Tesla's predicted 100 years ago that if you did

(00:58:20.048):
this judiciously,

(00:58:30.357):
And everybody was returning the majority of the power they were using back

(00:58:33.899):
and forth, back and forth.

(00:58:35.400):
That the same grids that we use now,

(00:58:37.901):
the same generating facilities that we use now,

(00:58:40.723):
could sustain a thousand times the power that we can deliver now for

(00:58:45.305):
the same fuel consumption.

(00:58:48.527):
We've been ripped off.

(00:58:51.869):
How do you meter it?

(00:58:53.049):
Ah, that's where Tesla gets killed.

(00:58:55.551):
Oh no, you meter it to

(00:59:00.440):
The problem is it changes the economics of the thing.

(00:59:04.921):
So, you know, that's why JP Morgan said, pardon me while I pull the plug.

(00:59:09.002):
But if we get to the point in the world where this is the way to go,

(00:59:12.903):
there has to be another means of reimbursement for everybody.

(00:59:15.704):
The most important thing that we learn from this, guys, and you have to understand this,

(00:59:26.934):
Is that when the traditional power measurements are made,

(00:59:31.258):
and everybody says, okay,

(00:59:32.480):
if we hang a resistive load directly on an alternating current source,

(00:59:37.825):
that is the closest thing we can come to 100% efficiency.

(00:59:40.968):
Because I measure,

(00:59:41.709):
let's say,

(00:59:42.149):
100 watts here,

(00:59:43.430):
and I measure 100 watts at the source, and you can't do any better than that.

(00:59:46.994):
This proves that there's extra energy there, or I couldn't do this.

(00:59:53.067):
No, but isn't that extra energy part of the phantom energy?

(00:59:56.728):
Well, call it what you want.

(00:59:58.149):
It's still there.

(00:59:59.369):
And what's interesting about it is...

(01:00:00.849):
I mean, they know about this, but they don't know how to capture it or whatever.

(01:00:04.991):
Well, they don't know how to capture it because their thinking is

(01:00:07.431):
wrong.

(01:00:10.012):
I was just going to say,

(01:00:10.953):
when Maxwell originally was doing his fundamental work on the transmission

(01:00:15.954):
of energy, he made the assumption

(01:00:19.869):
That all of the energy was carried only in the electric and magnetic fields.

(01:00:24.493):
And he did all of his equation work from that.

(01:00:27.775):
Years later,

(01:00:28.656):
and it was like 30 years later,

(01:00:30.897):
Einstein v.

(01:00:32.399):
Einstein and de Haas,

(01:00:34.240):
who was another physicist,

(01:00:35.861):
redid all of these experiments that Maxwell had done at an earlier time.

(01:00:41.128):
And they found that there was additional energy that was carried by

(01:00:44.252):
the current itself, not by the fields.

(01:00:47.557):
And they said, oh, well,

(01:00:48.498):
it's a fairly sizable number,

(01:00:49.940):
but we don't want to rock the boat and change all the equations,

(01:00:52.604):
so they just let it alone.

(01:00:53.845):
But there

(01:00:54.386):
it is.

(01:00:54.546):
That's right.

(01:01:21.231):
Let me first lay some foundational work for you.

(01:01:26.754):
The whole idea of free energy,

(01:01:29.916):
which is a term that I utterly despise,

(01:01:34.059):
has given people this notion that under the right circumstances you just sort

(01:01:38.862):
of pull energy out of the air or out of somewhere and you have an abundance of it

(01:01:43.785):
and it only requires a small trickle to get it going and this is the This is

(01:01:49.607):
the golden calf that everybody's looking for.

(01:01:53.370):
And frankly,

(01:01:55.311):
I'm not saying someday something like that may or may not be possible,

(01:01:59.374):
but right now that is certainly not what I'm trying to do

(01:02:04.157):
and it is certainly not what Tesla did.

(01:02:07.640):
And so I think the first thing to do is to answer your question by sort of giving

(01:02:14.785):
a real superficial explanation of what Actually happens and then I'll put

(01:02:21.172):
in some definition

(01:02:24.695):
so that you can better identify the terminology.

(01:02:30.119):
First of all,

(01:02:31.200):
when you run a load of some sort,

(01:02:34.523):
particularly a resistive load connected to standard power line,

(01:02:40.888):
you're essentially drawing power from the grid and it's going through your device

(01:02:47.159):
And then it's changed into heat or light or whatever you're trying to do.

(01:02:51.802):
And the present belief is that that energy then leaves the system at a rate which is

(01:02:59.707):
as close to 100% efficiency as you can possibly have.

(01:03:03.989):
And that's why a resistor is used to generally calibrate the losses in a system

(01:03:11.354):
because the belief is that whatever power you put into it is Converted to heat

(01:03:18.207):
a hundred percent conversion rate and that's the end of the ball game.

(01:03:23.008):
Well interestingly enough that's not what Tesla said and while I can't quote

(01:03:27.609):
from memory every single thing I read from that guy's work,

(01:03:31.670):
I can tell you that the stuff I did read got me animated enough to look at it from

(01:03:38.351):
a different perspective and I said well what if you borrow the wattage

(01:03:42.952):
that you're interested in using And then have a

(01:03:47.085):
means of actually...

(01:03:48.606):
We should be getting that patent.

(01:03:50.566):
And that was the first thing we built and the last thing we patented just because

(01:03:53.787):
of circumstances.

(01:03:54.747):
So it's sitting there right behind you.

(01:03:56.647):
But it, you know, we built the thing and then it's just the same story as Jim's got.

(01:04:05.089):
You know, you're trying to raise money and show people and just like talking to bricks.

(01:04:10.150):
Right.

(01:04:10.390):
You know, so, you know, so they were...

(01:04:13.615):
It was beyond,

(01:04:14.556):
at the time,

(01:04:15.136):
it was beyond anybody's understanding,

(01:04:17.458):
so the investment people were dealing with and said,

(01:04:19.940):
well, what can you do with your switching besides this motor?

(01:04:22.562):
So we weren't sure, you know, so that was clear back in 2002, 2003.

(01:04:29.248):
So we started hooking the thing up to regular,

(01:04:31.249):
you know,

(01:04:31.710):
DC motors,

(01:04:32.530):
AC motors,

(01:04:33.291):
and putting other applications to the electronics,

(01:04:35.673):
and we just found that we could just do amazing things with inductive devices,

(01:04:41.958):
and that's where So we decided we were going to patent our electronics first

(01:04:47.118):
before we patented the motor.

(01:04:48.738):
And that's a long,

(01:04:49.899):
long winding story of,

(01:04:52.280):
you know,

(01:04:52.860):
we had a lot of great people we had to deal with and we had a lot of shysters,

(01:04:56.182):
you know,

(01:04:56.482):
people trying to beat us out of our intellectual runoff of our patent for it.

(01:04:59.883):
This is an incredible story.

(01:05:01.464):
Someday I'm going to write a book about it.

(01:05:04.265):
But so it took a long time to get back to the motor.

(01:05:06.847):
Right.

(01:05:07.927):
Before we had the funds, we could apply the patent for it.

(01:05:10.348):
So two years ago, we actually Okay, now I get to apply for it.

(01:05:13.694):
It was one of the most frustrating things I ever went through to get

(01:05:16.416):
the patent filed on that thing.

(01:05:18.598):
But now we're pretty close to getting it granted, so we're waiting for the office actions.

(01:05:22.922):
Which that motor is actually sitting about two, three feet behind me right now.

(01:05:26.244):
Yeah.

(01:05:26.745):
In one of your several labs where you do this kind of work.

(01:05:30.288):
And so the motor that you're talking about with the similarities,

(01:05:34.251):
Jim, would that be your Dynaflux alternator?

(01:05:37.602):
Well there are

(01:05:41.243):
several motors involved in the whole thing but the one that had

(01:05:44.664):
the greatest similarity was a device that we refer to as a toroid motor and Paul

(01:05:50.805):
and I got discussing motors in general and we found out that we were both kind

(01:05:54.906):
of like on the same track and then I started to explain to them about the concepts

(01:05:59.827):
of energy resonance as I perceived them from Tesla's work which is totally different

(01:06:05.248):
from frequency resonance and

(01:06:06.589):
of course everybody It politely informs you there's no such thing

(01:06:10.457):
as energy resonance.

(01:06:12.417):
So you have to always, you know...

(01:06:15.138):
Like, what do you mean you investors left you?

(01:06:18.219):
What do you mean you've had this sitting around for 15 years and nobody's gave a rat?

(01:06:23.480):
I was just, what?

(01:06:26.761):
I was just astounded, you know?

(01:06:28.922):
God, what kind of Box of Rocks guys you've been dealing with, you know?

(01:06:32.583):
Same kind of Box of Rocks guys I've been dealing with for years.

(01:06:37.578):
I said, this just will not do.

(01:06:39.058):
This stuff cannot languish, you know.

(01:06:41.079):
And so when it's like, especially with the SERPs, I said, I looked it over and he was right.

(01:06:46.260):
All's they had was standard MOSFET type switching, which isn't really true switching.

(01:06:50.801):
So I says,

(01:06:51.301):
you know,

(01:06:52.022):
what this place needs is flyback energy technology,

(01:06:55.242):
you know, the switching technology.

(01:06:57.443):
And so we've done some of that recently and it just, it's a marriage made in heaven, man.

(01:07:01.444):
The switching fixed it all right up.

(01:07:05.558):
We're there.

(01:07:06.598):
It's like what he calls switched energy resonance.

(01:07:08.839):
We call magnetic energy recovery.

(01:07:12.721):
It's all exactly the same concept.

(01:07:16.282):
Now about a week,

(01:07:17.482):
it was maybe a week ago,

(01:07:18.683):
I put on YouTube a short 10 minute excerpt out of a demonstration that you had done,

(01:07:25.065):
Jim,

(01:07:25.845):
with going from your DynaFlex alternator to the SERPs,

(01:07:29.747):
which is kind of like a solid state version of that general kind of concept.

(01:07:33.705):
And then you showed a transforming generator,

(01:07:36.347):
and in that clip it shows 100 watts roughly is being dissipated at the resistor,

(01:07:43.113):
creating heat,

(01:07:43.974):
you know,

(01:07:44.214):
so much it's about to start smoking,

(01:07:46.295):
yet only 5 watts are being pulled from the power supply.

(01:07:49.738):
And that's before you start changing the waveforms,

(01:07:52.240):
and suddenly it's still burning the same amount of heat in the resistor,

(01:07:55.363):
and the power supply is drawing negative 30 watts,

(01:07:57.505):
which means more is going back to it than is being drawn from it.

(01:08:01.146):
And that's created quite a buzz on the internet in a couple different forums and stuff.

(01:08:05.509):
I can see a lot of the discussions going on where,

(01:08:09.352):
you know,

(01:08:09.612):
it's kind of interesting how a lot of people have a lot of comments about what it is

(01:08:12.715):
and what it isn't without knowing anything about what it actually is.

(01:08:16.137):
You know, they kind of already have their minds made up.

(01:08:18.799):
But in general,

(01:08:20.341):
you know,

(01:08:20.561):
just kind of from a layman,

(01:08:21.521):
you know, the concept of reactive power is not really like a layman's concept.

(01:08:25.645):
But in those simple terms, it's using something known as reactive power.

(01:08:31.442):
That's supposed to be kind of like this phantom power that doesn't really exist yet.

(01:08:34.804):
You can actually put it to work and make it do real work?

(01:08:38.686):
Well, it's a little bit more involved than that.

(01:08:41.128):
But let me,

(01:08:42.268):
either you're in an argumentative mood and you tackle it directly

(01:08:46.511):
or you just circumvent the whole issue.

(01:08:48.992):
I'm so tired of the whole thing.

(01:08:50.393):
I generally don't get involved.

(01:08:51.834):
But with Paul, it was genuine questions of real interest.

(01:08:58.518):
And so I started to explain stuff to him.

(01:09:01.239):
And that's when he started to introduce the idea of his switching technology.

(01:09:06.023):
And interestingly enough,

(01:09:07.744):
in my own research we had come upon the limitations that are imposed

(01:09:13.508):
by normal quote-unquote electronic switches.

(01:09:18.892):
And the guy that I was working with at the time,

(01:09:22.735):
a fellow named Eric,

(01:09:25.177):
I had told him that I envisioned the fact

(01:09:28.639):
that Electronic switches were not true imitations of mechanical switches and

(01:09:35.565):
that that's what we needed to do.

(01:09:37.987):
And so we had actually spent a great deal of time and money on that,

(01:09:41.488):
not having found a solution.

(01:09:42.869):
We put it on the shelf for a while.

(01:09:45.030):
But then Paul informed me that they had actually solved the problem.

(01:09:49.672):
So as soon as I heard that I said,

(01:09:51.172):
well heck, there's a bunch of stuff that you and I can collaborate on.

(01:09:55.794):
And so one thing led to another and I started telling him about Some of

(01:10:00.430):
the electronic work that I had done and eventually I lit enough of his curiosity up

(01:10:09.057):
that he took a plane flight down and visited me in Oklahoma and I showed him the lab

(01:10:15.802):
and all of the stuff I had been working on for the past 20 years or so and it turned

(01:10:20.806):
into a really neat exchange.

(01:10:24.729):
So how was that going down to his lab, Paul?

(01:10:30.638):
In heaven, I was just astounded.

(01:10:32.480):
I was just astounded by everything I saw.

(01:10:34.621):
The quality of the work,

(01:10:36.063):
the amazing, you know, the amazing, the great theory it was all based on.

(01:10:41.607):
It was all the same thing we do, the same theory.

(01:10:44.129):
And we've taken our approach and his approach.

(01:10:47.692):
But it's really all the same theory.

(01:10:49.213):
So when it comes to how electricity works, it's like twin brothers.

(01:10:53.056):
You know, we get it.

(01:10:54.793):
And so the marriage of the two technologies was just,

(01:10:58.855):
it's inevitable, you know, so I was just utterly astounded when I was in Jim's lab.

(01:11:02.856):
So not very many things surprise you anymore,

(01:11:06.278):
but this was...

(01:11:07.258):
Oh yeah, oh yeah,

(01:11:08.639):
and then it's...

(01:11:16.322):
Well this is Aaron Murakami and Peter Lineman with A&P Electronic Media

(01:11:20.403):
from eMediaPress.com.

(01:11:23.025):
And today is May 27th,

(01:11:25.267):
and we're about four and a half weeks away from the 2014 Energy Science

(01:11:28.949):
and Technology Conference,

(01:11:30.831):
which you can learn about more at energiescienceconference.com.

(01:11:34.973):
And today sitting with us is Mr. Jim Murray and Paul Babcock.

(01:11:39.673):
And if you had followed the conference last year,

(01:11:42.615):
you know that both Jim Murray and Paul Babcock gave some of

(01:11:46.638):
the most popular presentations that we've ever had.

(01:11:50.521):
Jim Murray's presentation was Tesla's hidden discoveries

(01:11:54.064):
and Paul Babcock's presentation was actually his second.

(01:11:57.958):
Presentation at the conference,

(01:12:00.040):
in the 2012 conference,

(01:12:01.921):
he gave a presentation called Magnetic Energy Secrets,

(01:12:04.904):
and at the 2013 conference,

(01:12:06.605):
he gave a presentation, which was a follow-up on that, MagneticEnergySecrets.com.

(01:12:12.230):
The first one, Jim Murray's presentation is available at TeslasHiddenDiscoveries.com.

(01:12:17.982):
And both the Pulse presentations are available at Magnetic Energy Secrets.

(01:12:22.323):
Now, the first thing I kind of want to ask is that right through

(01:12:26.484):
the conference last year,

(01:12:28.084):
which was the end of last June,

(01:12:31.125):
you both hit it off pretty well and kind

(01:12:32.705):
of discovered there was some amazing synchronicities between a lot of

(01:12:35.866):
the work you guys have been doing over the years,

(01:12:38.386):
going on these parallel paths for a long time,

(01:12:41.807):
and you want to kind of go over how The similarities in both of your guys'

(01:12:46.253):
work?

(01:12:47.634):
Yeah, it was a real serendipitous Twilight Zone moment there.

(01:12:53.379):
When we realized we started going over our motor designs and realized

(01:12:59.004):
the incredible similarity between the motor designs and the concepts about how

(01:13:05.970):
to beat Lentz's Law, in balancing coupling and

(01:13:11.020):
A bunch of different stuff,

(01:13:12.060):
so it really kind of tweaked us both a little bit,

(01:13:14.702):
you know, and the meeting of the minds.

(01:13:16.763):
Right.

(01:13:18.003):
And from that point on,

(01:13:19.124):
it was just collaboration, you know, so it's made for a really interesting year.

(01:13:24.466):
And so your particular motor is the Flyback one,

(01:13:27.447):
which is patented, and you kind of went over it.

(01:13:29.788):
The patent hasn't been quite granted yet, but it's there.

(01:13:32.249):
Okay, but the application is published, and people can read that if they search for it.